Attracting, Engaging, and Delighting with SMS Marketing + HubSpot
Do you live in a world filled with corporate data? Are you plagued by siloed departments? Are your lackluster growth strategies demolishing your chances for success? Success? Are you held captive by the evil menace Lord Lack?
Intro:Lack of time, lack of strategy, and lack of the most important and powerful tool in your superhero tool belt, knowledge. Never fear, hub heroes. Get ready to don your cape and mask, move into action, and become the hub hero your organization needs. Tune in each week to join the league of extraordinary inbound heroes as we help you educate, empower, and execute. Hub Heroes, it's time to unite and activate your powers.
Intro:Before we begin, we need to disclose that Devin is currently employed by HubSpot at the time of this episode's recording. This podcast is in no way affiliated with or produced by HubSpot, and the thoughts and opinions expressed by Devin during the show are that of his own and in no way represent those of his employer.
Max Cohen:How How you
Liz Moorhead:doing, Liz? I'm good. Are we ready to rock a new episode of Hub Heroes?
David Gable:Yes.
Liz Moorhead:Even though we are unsupervised, George is on vacation Oh.
Max Cohen:We've been we've been de georged this week.
David Gable:That's great.
Liz Moorhead:I know. I did I don't know how I feel about it. Like, I know that he and I week after week will sometimes, like, you know, we keep each other on on each other's toes. You know? Yeah.
Liz Moorhead:Like, that's our thing.
David Gable:Mhmm.
Liz Moorhead:So I'm unchecked.
David Gable:I do like the lack of supervision. I do like the lack of supervision. Yeah. I like that part. That part's exciting.
David Gable:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Liz Moorhead:Yeah. Oh, yeah. I need an adult. I need another adult. Like, I need many adults.
David Gable:We get we get
Max Cohen:we get unhinged Liz this week.
David Gable:Yeah. Oh, boy. Yes. Yes. Liz Unchained, dude.
David Gable:Yes. Yeah. That's what's up.
Liz Moorhead:Yep. You know what else is nice, though, guys? We do have someone warming that seat this week. I'm I'm sure our listeners have noticed a new voice on. We've got David Gable, head of sales at Kixie.
Liz Moorhead:That's you, buddy.
David Gable:That is me. Hey, guys. How's it going?
Liz Moorhead:It's going great. So Kixie, my understanding is that you guys offer automated calling and texting solutions for sales teams using CRMs like HubSpot. Right?
David Gable:It's almost like someone the big It's almost like you read those words. Like, we those words were just given to you by someone here.
Liz Moorhead:I know. So Someone smart gave me
David Gable:accurate. Yes. Yeah. I could not have said it better myself. It was it's almost as if it were typed and emailed to you and read right back to me.
David Gable:It was so specific and actionable. I love it. It's great. Let's see. I know
David Gable:what you do.
Liz Moorhead:Proud of me. No one actually sent it to me. I did that research.
David Gable:Oh, did you really?
Liz Moorhead:That's what I did.
David Gable:Oh, she nailed it.
Liz Moorhead:I'm an I'm an empowered, strong, independent woman.
David Gable:You are and unsupervised, and you did that all on your own. It's amazing. Yes. It's amazing.
Liz Moorhead:I know. I know. One day, I'm
Max Cohen:gonna want to vote.
Liz Moorhead:Yeah. Thanks, bud. I look forward to hearing about that in my three sixty review.
David Gable:Yeah. Yes. I don't know what
Max Cohen:that is, but I'll be sure to give one to
David Gable:you. Okay.
Liz Moorhead:So clearly, with someone like David on today, as our folks at home might have guessed, we are talking about SMS texting in the context of marketing. And that's a bit of a controversial topic depending on who you ask. So I want us to go ahead and just dive right into this conversation. David, before I get to you Yep. Max and Devin, when I say SMS text marketing, what immediately comes to mind for you?
Liz Moorhead:Because I will admit as I was preparing for this, I kinda had some complex feelings about it. There are some brands that the way they use SMS texting, it makes me want to chuck my phone into a river. But then there are other cases where I I started going through my phone, and I'm like, oh, wow. But they're actually ones that I interact with very regularly that are purposeful, that are helpful, and that I actually use. So it made me wonder, you know, my knee jerk reaction.
Liz Moorhead:I don't like SMS texting. Maybe it's it's more circumstantial. But Max and Devin, I would love to hear from you guys about that. What are your initial thoughts thoughts when you hear about?
Max Cohen:I wanna say one word. I wanna say one word. That's my initial thoughts. And then I want Devin to go into his thing because I think they'll tie together very well. Ready?
Max Cohen:Yes. Careful. Careful. That's what I'm gonna say. Great power comes create responsibility.
Max Cohen:Careful. Right? Take it away. Oh, God.
Liz Moorhead:I'm already already in the chat. Wait, wait. Are you receiving point that in the chat.
David Gable:SMS marketing right now, Devin? Is that what's going on? Have you gotten text message marketing? Yeah. He has.
Liz Moorhead:He's gotten, like, five.
David Gable:That's the danger right there. Look what can happen. You could derail a whole webinar just with improperly timed text message communication.
Liz Moorhead:We also talk about how Chad in the chat pane was already ready for this. I'm ready for a Devon rant. So, Devon, take it away, bud.
David Gable:I could barely contain myself trying to be really, you know, respectful of our guest and the work you do. But I hate SMS text messaging with a passion. Like, it it it goes beyond chapping my hide. It it it really, like, with with Grinds your gears, sir. Like, from the core of my being, I hate it.
David Gable:I have never gotten an SMS marketing text that I was happy with. The only time text messaging from a company is okay to me is when it's transactional. Like, when I'm calling AAA and they're letting me know someone's coming. Outside of that, the store letting me know that they've got this sale because I put my number in the kiosk for my receipt, I know. Oh my god.
David Gable:Or one time I applied
David Gable:for a
David Gable:loan, and these people keep, oh, by the way, you got approved for the loan. Yeah. But I didn't get it, so leave me alone. And
David Gable:Yeah. And and and I
David Gable:keep like, I've marked them as spam, and they still because I I did stop, and it didn't work. And then and then I marked them as spam. And so now I get these and they send them from new numbers. But my phone is smart enough to be like, I know that's spam. And so every now and then, I'll get a text message indicator.
David Gable:And then I look at the text message says, hey. This was spam. And I'm like, I already know who it was from, because they're the only ones that are blowing
David Gable:me up.
David Gable:But I never never since SMS messaging has become a thing have I been happy to get a text from a company. And the only thing the only thing that frustrates me more about SMS text messages is the fact that they work. I hate the fact that people get revoked from SMS messages because that just guarantees that I'm gonna get more messages. And it's like
David Gable:Yep.
David Gable:I I wish I wish you people weren't so okay with strangers texting you because then they wouldn't text me. I wish there was an SMS do not text list that I could just get on Yeah. Just to because it's like it's like direct mail, except instead of your mailbox, they're in your bathroom. And it's just it's so so intrusive and just so annoying. Yeah.
Liz Moorhead:But every seven times every week.
David Gable:Yeah. Yeah. I think I know. Let let it out, though. Estimates of the
David Gable:channel has reported positive results, and I hate it.
Max Cohen:Yeah. They're in the bathroom, and they got the remote switched to your bidet is what they're. But, like, this
David Gable:is like, so
David Gable:They will get your attention.
Max Cohen:Obviously, it's your attention. Invasive. Right?
David Gable:Yeah. Now one
Max Cohen:thing that I wanna add on so because I wanted to say careful, and then I knew Devon was gonna do that. And then I wanna I wanna add my the rest of my thoughts onto that first. Right? Is, I I think of SMS almost in the same almost with a couple of key differences than I think about email. Right?
Max Cohen:There's a right way to do it. There's a wrong way to do it. Right? And I think everyone here, including you, David, is gonna agree with that.
David Gable:There's a right
Max Cohen:and wrong way to do everything that you do with HubSpot or or anything else. Right? When I think of texting, I think the biggest kind of difference between that and email because think about it. With emails, like, I look at screen. I see message that has words.
Max Cohen:I maybe do something because of it. Yep. Like, in that sense, they're the same. However, email is very passive. People can interact with their email when they want to.
Max Cohen:They can shut their notifications off. They could say, I'm only gonna check my inbox later. And in that point, it's just how much are you messing with their life when they're doing that.
David Gable:Yeah.
Max Cohen:Right? But you check your text messages immediately. You stop what you're doing and look at your text message. Your your Apple Watch taps you on the wrist and goes, hey. There's something really poor you got.
Max Cohen:You got it it trained you to do this. Yes. Right?
Liz Moorhead:It makes me so angry because I'll be like, is it a hot guy? No. It's 10% off of GEICO.
David Gable:Exactly. Next match. You know what I mean?
Max Cohen:Exactly. So when I when I think of SMS and when I think of, like, it's it's it's interesting with with for marketing, I think you gotta think about how marketing supports experiences that people go through. Yeah. And I think with SMS like, an SMS should not be doing, like, the job of a of a blog post.
David Gable:Right.
Max Cohen:Right? Blog posts and, like, content you create goes out there, and it interacts with people that you don't have permission to talk to yet. Yeah. Right? Because they just freely find it on the Internet.
Max Cohen:Right? However, if you get someone's cell phone number and you hit them up and you they were not expecting you to text them, that is, like, instant violation of, like, my privacy. Right? When I get political campaigns smashing me on text messages, I'm like, I can't write stop fast enough. And I hit the report button.
Max Cohen:I it's like, no. Don't do that to me. Right? Like, if you're gonna if you're gonna buy my info, shoot me an email. Don't text me.
Max Cohen:Right? Because, like, that text message could be a text from my wife, a text from my kid, a text from someone who's, like, really important to me. And when you've invaded that sacred attention wave that I have and you did it to try to sell me something and I didn't ask you to do that, hate you. Hate you so much. Right?
Max Cohen:However, if I was expecting to hear from you Yep. That's a different story.
David Gable:Yep.
Max Cohen:Right? So I think, like, it's the way in which you use it. I have two brands that I freaking love when they text me. Yeah. Right?
Max Cohen:And they're trying to sell me something, but it's under a very specific circumstance in which they know I buy their shit all the time. Right? And they know that something that I like is buying stuff from them, but they have the data to prove that. Yeah. They weren't doing this before they knew I liked to buy shit from them.
Max Cohen:They got my phone number a while ago. They didn't ramp up the text messaging until I spent a shitload of money with them.
David Gable:Yep.
Max Cohen:Right? You know, it wasn't, oh, we got your phone the first time, and you haven't bought anything from us?
David Gable:Which is what usually people do. Totally.
Max Cohen:Right? Don't do that. But it's like, hey. Thoughtful, like, drops of new products, including, like, a nice rich, like, image. I love it.
Max Cohen:And I'll I'll shout them out later and stuff, but that's kinda what I'm where I'm thinking. There's a time and place for it just like there is for anything else.
Liz Moorhead:Yeah. I totally David, I wanna turn to you here. Yeah. Because what I wanna what I would like to hear from you is, first of all, your reaction to the clearly complex myriad of feelings.
David Gable:Yeah. I know. I know. Just jumped on. Heard Devon's complex myriad of feelings.
David Gable:I heard Devon. Yeah. It was it was it was subtle, but I was able to tease it out. I it it's interesting. Can I when you message SMS messaging, I have the same initial reaction?
David Gable:You know, I'm a I'm a human who's evolved over millions of years to identify threats and generally ignore things that are going well. As such, when you ask about SMS messaging, my mind goes immediately to all those SMS that I do not want to receive. Like, immediately. Right? And what I forget oftentimes, unless I really think about, is how great it is to have SMS messaging instead of having to call people for all the things I've been texting them about.
David Gable:Right? Like, in my interpersonal day, I love texting because it's synchronous to my schedule, which is, like, the most important thing. Right? I'm willing to forego lots of benefits of a call, like tonality, not being not mistaking what the person is saying, getting angry at them for no reason, and then then them questioning whether why they've ever moved in with you. It's a long story, but, you know, text messaging is is a easy way to fall into traps like that.
David Gable:Calling, much better. Right? However, I'm willing to sacrifice all that because I'd much rather have it be in sync with my schedule. I can text you when it's convenient for me. You reply when it's convenient for you, and everything's gravy.
David Gable:But like Max said, we wanna make sure we're texting it at a time that is actually appropriate about a subject that I actually want to hear from you about. You know? And so Yeah. Like, I'll give you just a quick quick counterexample because I think it's better than me arguing in the abstract. But, like, if someone comes on to Kixie chat, and starts chatting, and they say, I love your chatbot.
David Gable:They don't ever say that. But but I wanna talk to a human. Right? And then they don't get a response in a minute, and then they bounce. Right?
David Gable:That person would love to get a text message probably if we have their from a from an agent here at Kixie, an actual human here at Kixie. Right? They would love that. Now they haven't overtly said to me, and you like to I'd like you to really hear this very often. Hey, please text me.
David Gable:You know? They're probably not gonna hear that. But, man, they would have to talk to a human. And so that's a great so we trigger an auto text, right, from an from an agent here, Kixie, to that person. Hey.
David Gable:Sorry. You're coming to call in the chat. Sorry. We couldn't get a human over to you in less than a minute. I'd love to talk to you whenever you're free.
David Gable:What what a great use of text messaging. So I think to Max's point, it is definitely contextual. And I think, you know, the mistake people make is thinking that it's, you know, it's a hammer. Everything's a nail. I just need to start in that send out more auto text.
David Gable:It's like it's like the bad days of email spam when it was just like, more emails. You know? And it's just like, when I send out enough tens of thousands of emails, people will buy my product. No one is buying your product direct off of SMS marketing. You know what I mean?
David Gable:Exactly. But but it can be a great way to bridge conversation. Yeah.
Max Cohen:And that's super interesting you bring it up. I think because because what we need to do for everyone listening here is, like, there's I think there's two different sort of, like, schools of thought when we're thinking about texting inside of HubSpot. There's sending texts meant to be the sort of, like, traditional I hate saying the word blast. Right? Where it's like, here's a list of people.
Max Cohen:We're gonna promote this thing Yep. And send it out to everybody. And that would I think when people think of, like, marketing text message, a lot of people are thinking of that.
David Gable:Yep.
Max Cohen:Right? Whereas kinda what you mentioned, you're not talking about sending out texts as if it was, like, an email blast to, like, a list of people. Correct. You're saying, how can we give a more convenient way
David Gable:Yep.
Max Cohen:For you and your sales rep to kind of connect with each other when waiting for a Zoom call scheduled at a certain time is not always gonna be convenient for everyone's schedule as well.
David Gable:That's exactly
Max Cohen:right. Yeah. So, like, in what's cool in HubSpot is, like, both of those things can happen. Right? And you can use them in unison, but there can be elements of marketing text messaging or SMS or whatever it is.
Max Cohen:But then there's literal ways where you inside the HubSpot interface, like, you could literally empower your sales reps to have text conversate conversations, not Yep. Broadcasts, like, conversations back and forth for someone who likes to just be able to text. So it's like, you got a rep working on a deal or something. They've got a quick question about, like, the configuration of the of the doodad that you're selling them. You can, like, you can, like, say, oh, hey.
Max Cohen:Did you need this the red or in the blue? Yeah. Oh, the blue. Okay. Great.
Max Cohen:I'll update the quote for it.
David Gable:Nailed it.
Max Cohen:Instead of being, like, let's hop on a Zoom call to be, like, whatever this is. You know what I mean?
David Gable:So One you you nailed it. 1100%. And and I think the keyword, you know, you mentioned, like, unsolicited text message. The keyword being solicited. Right?
David Gable:Like and oftentimes, that solicitation might not come in really over a way, like, hey. Please text me at my cell phone number. But it might come at, like, hey. I'd love to talk to a human or or crap. I didn't identify which color I want the do that in.
David Gable:I would love to get a text message saying confirming red or blue. You know what I mean? Like, that would be great.
Max Cohen:Yeah.
Liz Moorhead:Yeah. So, David, here's where I what I wanna ask you for a moment. You know? Because we're we're seemingly having a conversation about what SMS can be Yes. And what it should be for marketing and sales organizations using inbound.
Liz Moorhead:But then we also have to wrestle with the fact of what is in some cases. Yes. The reason why Devon, our complex man of nuanced emotion. And and quite frankly, me too. I think we we've all been on the receiving end of the good, the bad, and the ugly.
Liz Moorhead:Yep. So where do organizations go wrong? How are they thinking about SMS incorrectly that leads to literally not customer delight? Yeah. It's prospect and buyer repellent.
David Gable:Yes.
Liz Moorhead:How does that happen?
David Gable:I I think if I think they get it wrong by thinking it's one of two things. Either a panacea, meaning all I need to do is SMS enough people and they will buy my product, or that it's completely useless and I should abdicate that entire medium and focus only on calling an email. The two other ways I can annoy people and get them to scare them away from buying my product and values directly. You know? So I think though those if you find yourself gravitating towards a poll on the issue, I would say you're probably wrong.
David Gable:It's a it's the same standard I use for politics sometimes. If you find yourself really gravitating really strongly, maybe, like, I I would edge towards the middle a little bit. Meaning, I think SMS is actually the preferred method of communication for most of us for most of our day. And because it's preferred, we're especially defensive about it. You know what I mean?
David Gable:Like, anything valuable to us, Devin's especially Max is especially and me too. Really defensive about my SMS because I've given up on my inbox long, long ago. That thing is, it's just filled with slings and arrows from a million different marketers trying to get a hold of me. And so it's almost useless at this point. So I got I'm okay abdicating email.
David Gable:But please don't do that to my SMS. But, however, if it's something that if it's communication that I want, then, god, I'd love to have it over SMS. I mean, for me, if I had to handle all the communication I handle over text over calls or long form emails, what a pain that would be. You know what I mean? So, really, it's about someone in the chat was mentioning c for consent.
David Gable:It really is, I think, looking for indicia of consent, like, or indicia of wanting that communication. Indicia meaning just some indicator from that person that this would be a good method of communication for me, and it's not gonna usually be direct.
Liz Moorhead:Much on this podcast.
David Gable:I know. We do need new ways.
Liz Moorhead:New strategy.
David Gable:Yeah. And it's fun. Look at these backgrounds and that these hats people are wearing. I mean, this is a fun podcast and yet informative at the same time. It's amazing.
David Gable:We're doing both things. You know what I mean?
Liz Moorhead:That's right.
David Gable:All the things. Right. So I think looking for indicia and then triggering call like, calls or triggering text messages based off of that. HubSpot is, like, my my favorite platform to build workflow automations in. My favorite.
David Gable:And the great thing is we can automate text either through Kixie or through HubSpot itself that go direct to a person from someone on your team at a time that is convenient for them. So someone you send out an email, and the email has a embedded video in it from Vidyard to one of these other companies. And that's awesome. You see they watch the entire video. It goes through all minute and a half on an email.
David Gable:Dude, someone spent ninety seconds watching my video. There's some interest there. That's not a bad time to text them and just say, hey. What'd you think of the video? And have that text come from me.
David Gable:And you can auto text them right up to your workflow. And just real it's a real soft thing. What'd you think of the video? I'm not saying, hey. Buy my product.
David Gable:I saw you watch the video. More text messages. It's not that. It's just like, hey, what do you think of it? That's great.
David Gable:That's a great way to open up some communication and it's less intrusive than a direct call. You know what I mean? So I think to answer your question, like, I I think it's it for companies, it's about finding indicia of consent or indicia of, like, an invitation. What what action has this this potential, customer made that means that tells me, hey. There's a soft invitation here to text me, and it's probably gonna be useful.
David Gable:You know?
Max Cohen:If you bought your if you bought their number, don't text them. Just don't. Like, that's a good, like, rule of thumb. If they gave it to you, it's one thing. Yeah.
Max Cohen:Right? But, like, let's also remember too, and because which when you say the indicia and I always say indicator, which I'm imagining is the same thing here. Right? You're the same thing. They're somehow saying but I like that word so much better.
Max Cohen:I'm gonna start saying I used it too. Does it
David Gable:sound cool? It sounds fancy. I tried
David Gable:to do it too.
Max Cohen:I love it. So the where I was gonna go with this is, like, it's it's it's one thing to collect the email. I mean, it's one thing to collect the phone number, but it's also another thing to understand how you're allowed to use it. Yeah. Right?
Max Cohen:So, like, that could be something as simple as saying a little checkbox that says it's okay to text me. Yeah. Right? Check it off. Have that on because inside of HubSpot for the new SMS tools, right, there's, like, you can only send to people that have, like, a certain property checked or consent checked or something like that.
Max Cohen:Right? And so, like, you could power that property getting switched from that. Right?
David Gable:Yep.
Max Cohen:You know, or it could just be, you know, maybe your your sales rep asking that first call, hey. Is it okay for me to, like, text you? Yeah. Cool. Check a box.
Max Cohen:Bump. Good good to go. 100%. You know, things like that. Especially, like, it's ease it's easy to ask for that consent.
Max Cohen:Right? And you owe you really want to because the last thing you wanna do is get some information from someone and not know how you're allowed to use it and then potentially create a really bad interaction with them. Right? So it's, like, it's easier just to figure out if you have the consent or
David Gable:not to
Max Cohen:do it.
David Gable:And as a as a anything to keep it. Yeah. Go for it. Oh, I was I was gonna say, that's a helpful nugget too. When you're asking for that consent or, like, or or I sent it, you know, I think just saying, like, mentioning the alternative.
David Gable:So, hey, would you love me to would you like it to to text back at as we move through this process, would you like to do it over text as opposed to me calling you and emailing you? When you phrase the alternatives, you're like, oh, well, I mean, I definitely don't wanna jump on a phone call. I mean, dude, a phone call is like someone just show these days, a phone call, it's like someone just showing up to your door and being like, hey, David. I'm here. And it's like, what the hell?
David Gable:I I I I'm not ready for a phone call. I can't I don't know how long the call is gonna be. I don't know what you know, I I've got things to do. Oh my god. It's a shocking thing these days to be called.
David Gable:So, like, as an as an alternative to that, I mean, sure. I'd rather you text me than that. You know? Like yeah.
Liz Moorhead:Well, I think the key to keep in mind though, David, and at least this is where I'm coming from on it, is that over the past, I don't know, ten, fifteen, twenty years, it's become easier for consumers to throttle and block ads. Right? As we've become more inundated, whether we're talking about television, whether we're talking about I remember when folders were introduced in Gmail and all of a sudden, all the emails that Us Marketers were sending got started going to, like, promotions Yeah. Started getting buried elsewhere. And so what's fascinating about this is that when it comes to SMS, it's one of the last few places where you can kinda catch somebody off guard.
David Gable:There is.
Liz Moorhead:There is no real filtering. So what I find fascinating about it is, like, I'll even catch myself eye rolling sometimes when I receive texts from people I opted into.
David Gable:Yeah. Yeah. And I think
Liz Moorhead:that's one thing marketers need to keep in mind is that I think they treat it sometimes with the same mindset as other channels. Mhmm. Like, if I send an email, I have the expectation of, well, somebody will read that, you know, when they're when they're ready to read it.
David Gable:Yep.
Liz Moorhead:But when it comes to texting, that's not the same thing. I think there needs to be a little bit more reverence and kind of purposeful intention around when you're reaching out to people because texting is jarring. I mean, now people are like I I don't know if anybody else is like this, but I am perpetually on do not disturb on my own phone. Like, I just got so tired of every app and notification and text that I get. It's just like a constant barrage of stuff.
Liz Moorhead:Yeah. Yeah. But it it I think it's frustrating because texting is one of the last places where we're supposed to be just getting good happy messages, not junk mail.
David Gable:Mhmm.
Liz Moorhead:And I think it's starting to feel that way.
David Gable:You're right. Yeah. So it's one of those things where where you wanna make sure these are good happy messages you're sending out these people. You wanna make sure that, like, there is a real this text message is delivering something of value in some way to this person. Like, I I am helping so I I'll I'll I'll give you an example.
David Gable:My you know, I I'm the head of sales over at Kixie. And so my guys get on sales calls all the time, and we're trying to negotiate these deals across weeks or months. And oftentimes, we'll invite someone to a Slack channel or something like that. Why? Like, not because we want to get a Slack notification all the time from them, but because, man, is it easier to coordinate when you have some quick, asynchronous communication, meaning it's synced to my schedule and you can read it within whenever it's yeah.
David Gable:At the time, it's convenient for you rather than just me trying to call everybody or doing one of those crazy email threads where someone replies in the middle of the thread, and then it surfaces back up that half the thread, but not the rest of the three. You know? Like, it's great. So texting is in a similar vein. If you're trying to move through a process and you're really trying to solve a problem for a customer, you know, sales comes off with a, you know, with a as a as a negative thing so often.
David Gable:But, like, at the end of the day, sales done well is really helping them solve a problem that they're experiencing. And so if I'm getting help over text message, well, that's not so bad. I mean, if someone texts me saying, hey, David. I'm happy to help you move. I'm like, oh, well, well, well.
David Gable:That's a that's a text message I would love to hear. So and in the same way, we help moving companies do exactly that. You know? So, I think I think.
Max Cohen:Well, I mean, because they're they're getting value in exchange for the time they're getting value in exchange for the time it takes for them to interact with the medium. And that's like what makes emails that and that's what makes a good email versus a bad email. Right. Because, like, whenever we interact with something on a screen, right, we're wasting our time in order to see what it is and see if it's value. And if it's not, we hate it.
Max Cohen:And if it is, we go, I'm fine with the time I just spent doing it. Totally. Right? And so the same goes for text messages. But yeah.
Liz Moorhead:David, you've alluded to a couple so far. Yeah. What are some great examples that you've seen with your clients in terms of how they, with purpose and intention, integrate SMS into their inbound marketing or sales programs? What does that look like?
David Gable:So, one of the example I gave earlier is a great one. Obviously, that's, like, really overt in this year. Right? Someone comes into a chat, tries to engage, wants a human, can't find a human, leaves. You auto text them back from a human.
David Gable:Amazing. You saved the day. You're Spider Man with text messaging. It's you know what I mean? Great.
David Gable:The great power and responsibility met in one, and you were able to web them and get them back to home safely, whatever it is. So, like, that's that's great. That's a that's an easy example. Usually, they're not so strong. So, like, I do wanna I've got I have so much sympathy now as someone who runs sales teams with salespeople.
David Gable:And so for those of you who watch the webinar who are like, yeah. But I I mean, I wanna sell more. I get it. I get it from a consumer standpoint, texting sucks. But it's the one medium that works right now.
David Gable:Like, how do I make use of it? Right? And so for those people listening with that question, like, I'll get a a great example. So it was COVID. We locked down.
David Gable:I was working with, a large pest control company that ends in Erminex. And they, they they they couldn't go door to door anymore. Right? And there were all these bug problems that are localized specific areas. So all part of Ohio has cicadas everywhere or whatever.
David Gable:Right? And so they they can't go door to door and help people, but they would love to hit, you know, hit people up and let them know, hey. If this wave of cicadas or whatever, like, flows over your home and the pestilence spreads and you would love us to deal with it, we're happy to help. Right? Well, what they were able to do was they were able to send out emails because, again, we want soft initial contact.
David Gable:We don't wanna spam everybody in Ohio or Cincinnati saying, hey. Cicada problem. Text me here, and we're gonna create a bunch of Devons everywhere. They just hate hate this company. You never never wanna hear from me.
David Gable:They'll be like, no. You know what? The Cicadas aren't the pest. You're the pest for texting me. Right?
David Gable:So, like, we don't want that. So instead, what what they do, they send out the email campaign with an embedded video just like, hey. If you see this this kind of bug at husk, that that's that's an indicia of this kind of bug. We would love to go over and help you to use that word again. And so when they watch that video, if someone watched it all the way through, not just watch part of it and skipped it, watched it all the way through, then it would trigger a text message saying, hey.
David Gable:Sorry. What what do you think of the video? You know what I mean? If they got a response over text message that wasn't like, do not text me ever again, great. Then it's like, they were gonna text me saying, I did see that.
David Gable:I think we have those damn things or whatever. Like, I tried to get it for myself. I couldn't. Great. We'll send someone out over there to help.
David Gable:And that was a whole they it became like a nationwide campaign, but they made it very specific. Again, they weren't just sending out a random mass text to everyone in The United States saying, hey. Do you have a pest problem? Like, that's the wrong way to do it. But specific to their area, like, hey.
David Gable:We noticed there are a bunch of silverfish in this area hitting these homes. You're in the area. Just have you seen this? Here's a video explaining it. And then if they would watch the video or reply to the email or workflow automation is triggering the text, that's great.
David Gable:Awesome.
Max Cohen:That's that's that's brilliant, actually. Because, like, what they're doing is, like, they're doing so one, very targeted. Right? Because it's like, we know the cicadas are here.
David Gable:Yes.
Max Cohen:Right? And I'm pretty sure the the the the cicadas are related to the Indicious too. Never mind. How's it dumb?
David Gable:Yeah. Speaking
Liz Moorhead:of Indicious
David Gable:speaking of
Liz Moorhead:Indicious. I
David Gable:don't know.
Liz Moorhead:It's a big
Max Cohen:point. Not just an
David Gable:up joke.
Max Cohen:So it's that's great. But, like, the fact that they were thoughtful enough to say, hey. We could get them to do this thing, watch this video. And if they skip out in the two seconds, they clearly don't give a shit.
David Gable:Right? Right.
Max Cohen:If they watch the whole thing, then we have, like, a really cool indicator there of, like, this might actually be not just relevant because of where they are, but relevant because of the fact they watched the whole video means they may have seen these things have been going, oh, shit. Oh, I'm gonna actually hear what they have to say. Yep. Right? Because if they didn't care, they'd be gone in a second.
Max Cohen:Hundred percent. No one's gonna watch a five minute bug video if they were seeing those bugs outside. Yeah.
David Gable:You're exactly right.
Max Cohen:You know, unless you're like my five year old. She loves bugs. But
Liz Moorhead:So, Devin, I have a question for you here because you've been you have understandable feelings. But as we've been unpacking this conversation around indigia and how how these social programs can be
David Gable:My number one is don't text me.
Liz Moorhead:Where does it remind you?
David Gable:On your list. I don't I
Liz Moorhead:don't care what Whether that's
David Gable:you
Liz Moorhead:can see the case for it or you just have more pleas for marketing and sales teams, just please do not screw me. Don't.
David Gable:Yeah. Like,
David Gable:like, oh my like, I I have I have a burner Google voice number specifically for Specifically.
David Gable:Things that we're doing.
Liz Moorhead:Even if he says
David Gable:yes even
Liz Moorhead:if he says yes, it's a no.
David Gable:He doesn't mean it.
David Gable:I,
Max Cohen:Yeah. Devin doesn't actually even have a phone number. He got rid of our gestures. Yes. I I've
David Gable:I I knew, when I was working, an agency, there was Nice. There was a, a house flipper that was using, SMS to, let people know about houses that were available in in, or or, in in in trying to, even purchase some homes, and it worked for them. It was great. And so there there are go ahead.
David Gable:You're saying you don't have enough of a cicada problem yet for SMS to be okay. You you're saying that the the the spread of locusts, cicada, whatever needs to be much higher for Devon to be really committed to this thing.
Liz Moorhead:Until the cicadas are asking for squatter strikes, I feel like Devin's out on the cicadas.
David Gable:It's not it's not enough, dude. You'd rather live live in live in harmony with the cicadas. Yeah.
David Gable:Basically, there there is no there there is no cicada level because I I've I've driven through Cicada Country, and there is no, like because at that point, I don't need you to
Max Cohen:text me.
David Gable:I'll already call. If if it's if it's that, don't
David Gable:text me. Just don't text me.
David Gable:Just don't text me.
Liz Moorhead:Yep. Yes. I actually I saw you lean up on that mic, so I was gonna say, Max, do you have some questions for Devin?
Max Cohen:Can I Liz, can I interrogate Devin for a second? Okay. Alright. I wanna see where Devin is on some of these things. Okay.
Max Cohen:So alright. So, I'm gonna just ask you a couple of questions. You tell me if you're okay with it or not. If you were, like, in the sales process, let's say you had a conversation with a sales rep. It's a product you're, like, seriously consider buying, but it's a complex sales cycle.
Max Cohen:Are you okay texting with the sales rep? No. Okay. Alright. Interesting.
Max Cohen:That's just you. No. No. No. I know.
Max Cohen:I know it. But again Yeah. Yeah. You don't
David Gable:like just me.
Max Cohen:Yeah. You only like getting texts
David Gable:from those that
Max Cohen:you're close with.
David Gable:We aren't that close.
Max Cohen:So, like, what if it's like so even, like, with convenient stuff. So let's say you're I think we mentioned triple a before. Right? You're you're you're stuck on the side of the highway, and the the truck gets assigned to you, and they're on their way out, and you get a text. Is that cool?
Max Cohen:So convenience. Yep. Oh, yeah. Okay.
David Gable:Transaction. Absolutely. My Walmart delivery is almost here.
Max Cohen:Absolutely. Texts that are, like, hyper specific to something you just did. You're saying transactional. That makes a lot of sense. Right?
Max Cohen:So if you just bought something, right, and it has to do with what you bought or requested or something like that, you're okay with text automations that are simple notifications, right, just keeping you in the loop, which is very different than a conversation with a sales rep, which is also very different than a, hey. You don't know us, but we're trying to sell you something. Right? Like, those are I I'm trying to, like, form the categories you're okay with and the ones that you're not.
David Gable:Yeah. Yeah.
David Gable:Text message is telling me that what I asked for is on the way, and that's it. Like, don't even ask me for feedback. Just tell me that, like, okay. You you you you got the delivery from Walmart. This person just started shopping.
David Gable:Okay. This person just substituted some. This person just dropped is on their way to drop it off. This person just
Liz Moorhead:Interestingly enough, Chad, in the chat, he just he brought up a very similar scenario in which how his company uses it. He says another thing we do is inspections on route SMS texts from the sales rep's number. We use a system that has a live tracking link, and it sends a bio that is about the rep, their image, and the link. Then they can follow along with the rep and call the number back to get a hold of that specific user, on the way to do the inspection, which I think is a Yeah. Really neat thing.
Liz Moorhead:And I I like what you're talking about there, Max, about the categories of it. I think there's a very big difference between solicitation on like, unsolicited solicitation, right, and something that has to do with the completion of a transaction or or a service or however it's being rendered. What would you say so I wanna take a moment here before we run out of time to talk a bit about technology. So, obviously, Kixie, which is this particular platform, it has the capability to integrate with CRMs like HubSpot. So, David, can you talk to us a bit about the technology piece?
Liz Moorhead:What does that look like in terms of integrating those two types of of that app and HubSpot together? And, Max, I know you'll have thoughts about this as well. Don't you worry about that.
David Gable:Technology. Technology here. I've heard of technology. I've heard of it. I, I in fact, Chad Chad was yeah.
David Gable:In fact, Chad was mentioning in in Chad another thing too. It links in perfectly. He was talking about technology. He was saying, when when I get a text message, what I would love is for me human on the other side of it. And so you asked him for a second, like, what what side of the technology?
David Gable:Well, I think one of the things that we really provide value on it as an add on to kick to HubSpot, we integrate directly with HubSpot, Is you can trigger a text message not from a general marketing email or, sorry, text phone number, you know, associated with the company, but text message from an individual rep. That way, like and that way, it can be part of a deal that's already moving forward. You're already in progression. You already moved through certain stages, and maybe you're trying to buy a car or something like that. And all of a sudden, they got the car washed, and they don't rather using the stock images that you've been seeing on the initial website when you were browsing, perusing the car.
David Gable:They auto text you the brand new newly washed car photos where it's gotten, like, the inside. You can see everything, and that's cool. Like, that's a that's a good use of text messaging. You're already through it far along in the process. You've been approved for an auto loan.
David Gable:You're shopping around that you knew already expressed interest in that particular car, and now you're getting an auto text with some MMS with the individual photos of the car from the actual rep who you've been dealing with around the purchase. Like, that's that's great. That's a that's a very different experience and probably one more in line with what Chad wants. But, again, we're using stuff that sounds really scary. We're using it we're using text messaging.
David Gable:We're using it as part of a sales process, and we're using automated text messaging. If you only told me those three things about it, I'd be like, hell no. I was sound like Devin. I'd be like, no. No.
David Gable:No. I don't want any of that. But when you put it in context like that, you're like, oh, actually, that's kinda cool. I would I would like to have some MMS of, like, real photos and not these cheesy stock photos that were on the website when I first looked at the car. Like, that's sick.
David Gable:So I think making sure that you're using tech you can use technology in a way that makes it feel more human and facilitate human to human communication even if it's automated, which is kind of, you know, it's kind of, you know, an odd mix. You wouldn't expect that. It's a result that you wouldn't expect from an automation.
Max Cohen:Yeah. Is David, is Kixie, like does Kixie more so focus on that facilitating texting conversations between humans at your company and your and your customers? Or does it also have the element of where, like, brands are more so, like, you're getting a text from the brand versus, like, the, you know
David Gable:You could use us to send a text from brand. Where we really shine is texts and calls could be calling to. That's event based. And the event based, we're not I'm not meaning so much like July 4. I mean, like, someone opened the email, watched the embedded video, written reply to the email and say, yeah.
David Gable:I'd love to jump on a call. And And then you get an auto text saying, hey. What time works for you? I'm free these day these hours these days. Okay.
David Gable:That's very different. That's kinda cool. Like but even the again, even though it's automated, even though it's an automated reply based but it's based off of the event of the person interacting. So I think for a lot of the calling and texting I see and I see this all the time. So someone sets up a sequence, and sequences are so so cool.
David Gable:Right? You see them in HubSpot. You see them in other places like Sales Ops and Salesforce. And, like, sequence, like, call on day one, email on day two, call on day four, email on day 10. And that's great.
David Gable:Right? Like, for a sales rep, that's great. For a recipient, you're like, well, look, there's no particular reason you're calling on Thursday at 2PM in the afternoon on day four apart from it's convenient for your schedule as a sales rep. But me as a recipient, like, I'm doing stuff, man. I don't want a random text or call at 2PM on a Thursday.
David Gable:That's not that doesn't fit my schedule. But again so again, what we're looking for is we're looking for an event. So you send out the email or maybe you make the call on day one. And then we have triggers where we've sent out little pieces of bait, the email, the embedded video, you maybe they visit your website, maybe they engage with your chatbot, like, all this data flowing into HubSpot. And what people typically do with all that data flowing in is they call them a day four on Thursday at 2PM in the afternoon, and then send them an auto text because it's in their sequence.
David Gable:It's like, why are you doing that? You've all this data coming in. You know, when they're free, you know, when they're reading your emails, you know, when they're engaged with the chatbot, like it's a little creepy, but at least it's convenient to their schedule. And at least it's it's solicited in the sense that they're doing some action that lets you know they're actually interested in the product that you're trying to talk to them about. I think that's a much better way to use technology to facilitate human human communication like Chad wanted as opposed to, like, scaring people off from everyone to talk to you ever again and just replying no, stop texting me on their phone.
David Gable:You know?
Max Cohen:Yeah. Yeah. And then you guys also have, just, like, from a technology piece of it. I remember I don't know if I'm getting the name right, but you have these, like, I I don't know. I think call queues is the word inside of HubSpot.
Max Cohen:But you you have this feature where it's, like, if someone fills out a form, you can literally get them into, like, like, it it it basically auto calls them from or assign I I can't remember exactly how it works, but, like, it basically triggers one of your reps to call them and, like, puts them in
David Gable:a q to b call. Exactly. Right. So it fills out a form on your website. All of a sudden, a sales rep on your team, boom.
David Gable:They get a pop up form fill. Do you wanna make a call to this person? They click accept. They're automatically calling them. They don't pick up.
David Gable:You can drop an automatic voice mail. And then maybe you send them a text and say, hey. I dropped you an automatic voice mail. I won't text you again unless you want me to, but let me know a good time to call you. Again, now I'm at I'm texting them to find a good time to communicate with them.
David Gable:That's great. Now, again, I'm I'm texting them just in a way to get permission and to get some information from them. So again, I don't wanna be a spammy salesperson. At the end of the day, I wanna talk to you. And if you sell me no, I wanna go away and remove you from my list and never buggy again.
David Gable:You know, that that's the that's the ultimate goal here, not to just annoy people with my brand. You know? So I think the the incentives can be aligned between the person and the brand. It's just making sure we use the information available to us to be smart about it. You know?
Max Cohen:Yeah. Do y'all ever recommend that people and this is more like a strategy thing, like, and and kinda going back to the and now I can't even say indicia thing. Right? Would you encourage folks who when they see someone unsubscribes from their email, is
David Gable:that a pretty
Max Cohen:good indicator that, like, you probably shouldn't text them to?
David Gable:Got it. I get it. Is that something you
Max Cohen:guys have experimented with or looked at? Okay. Got it. So it's one of those things, like, hey, guys.
David Gable:It's safe to say. If they don't
Max Cohen:want your emails, probably don't send them a text either. Right?
David Gable:I think this is true for a lot of sales processes. A lot of automation gets used incorrectly. We saw we see automation come in and we're like, oh, I can automate everything. It's like, woah. Woah.
David Gable:Woah. Okay. Before we start automating everything, let's think about what the triggers these automations are. And the automation should work in both directions. They should both get people further along in the sales process and and encourage us to auto call or auto text in the community times.
David Gable:It should also do the opposite, which is they were giving me an issue that they do not want to be a part of this process anymore, that I extricate them as another word from all the other communication for the various channels I'm hitting them up in. Let's pull back on that. And that that's true for not even I mean, instead of a tangent, that's true for marketing spend as well. I see a lot of times people unsubscribe from emails and stuff, and that you're still your ad spend for LinkedIn sales ads, you know, your LinkedIn ads are still targeting that person. It's like, woah.
David Gable:Woah. What are you doing? Pull back from everything. Stop bugging them about Kixie or whatever it is. Like, they're not interested.
David Gable:They're, like, save yourself that marketing spend and put it towards someone who might actually be interested. Like Yeah. Let's unenroll people from things.
Liz Moorhead:So as we wrap up this conversation, I'd love to hear from all of you. And, Max, I actually wanna start
David Gable:with you
Liz Moorhead:this time. I would love to hear from you all. What would you like to see brands challenge themselves to do in 2024 when it comes to SMS and their marketing and sales programs? Devin, I'm predicting that your answer maybe don't, but, you know, I'm gonna leave room for you to prove me wrong, but we're gonna start with Max. Do not.
Liz Moorhead:Do not. Oh.
Max Cohen:Oh. Yeah.
David Gable:First, don't really
Max Cohen:dare fucking text Devin is the one thing that I'm gonna tell everybody to do. Don't. Don't. Because you know what?
David Gable:You know what?
Max Cohen:You'll end up on a podcast that you weren't even invited to. So, yeah, that's that's what's gonna happen. So, the just in that, he'll he'll he'll probably start a segment at
David Gable:the beginning where
Max Cohen:he goes, this is a list of the companies that texted me this week, and it will be an ongoing segment.
David Gable:That's not bad.
Max Cohen:That's a
David Gable:bad idea, actually. A clever idea.
Max Cohen:You better do that, Devin. We should start doing that right away and put him on blast. Yeah. Yeah. Devin's SMS shit list.
Max Cohen:Yeah. I'd I'd so so here's here's what I'd recommend. And I'm gonna I'm gonna say I'm gonna say maybe I'm gonna I'm gonna focus a little bit on on Yeah. Companies that that do rely on repeat business. Right?
Max Cohen:Specifically, ecommerce companies out there. There are two particular brands that I really love. One's called Melon. They make hats. And another one's called One Bone, which makes clothes for guys that are my size.
Max Cohen:Right? These guys do a really, really great job at sending not SMS, but MMS, which is like SMS is just plain text. MMS is where you can get, like, emojis, files, pictures, like, all these other things. Right? What they've done is they've clearly kind of figured out that I like to buy stuff from them because and and that is that is very interesting because most of the time, a goal or a challenge of your customer is not to buy things from you, especially if they've never bought anything from you in the past.
Max Cohen:However, if you've seen somebody buy something from you multiple times, there's a good chance that a goal of theirs can sometimes be to buy more stuff from you because they've clearly done it multiple times. It's gonna be way more, likely that that is somewhat even if it's a small one, at least a bit of an iota of a, a goal or challenge that someone has. Right? You know, and for those people, I'd say if there's any time that it's okay to send the, hey. Here's a here's a great deal on, you know, 20 off of, like, whatever, it's to the people who buy from you regularly.
Max Cohen:Right? There's there's so I think one, my my my thing there is take those messages that you're sending just to everybody because you're basically saying, I want everyone to buy from me. Right? So I'm gonna send everybody these coupons and these these freaking, you know, 20% off, like, you know, there's a sale going on thing. Don't send them to anybody.
Max Cohen:Send them to the people that buy from you regularly and stop annoying the people that don't. Yeah. Because you're just do you're just doing negative stuff to these the margins of folks that don't care about that, right, when you could just be focusing on the people that actually care. Right? Because I'm assuming, you know, the more people that report your text as spam or or I don't know if you feel that's even a thing, or, like, saying stop or, like, reporting you for, like, abuse or, like, whatever it may be.
Max Cohen:You wanna avoid that as much as possible and really kind of, you know, isolate the the the these these sort of, like, super bottom of the funnel, like, test text message messages to the folks who have actually indicated, like, buying from you is something I do regularly. Right? And just make sure it's used in the right spot. But I would also think too that how can you think of, like, new products that you have as, like, new content? Right?
Max Cohen:So a really cool thing that these companies do that I enjoy getting texted from let me actually I'll find Melon here, and I'll put it up on the screen. So Melon. So these guys, I could barely see it on the screen here. I don't really know. Every single time they send me a text, they only send me well, of course, it was the holiday, so they they were a little bit crazier on, like, the coupon stuff.
Max Cohen:Right? But they only text me when there's, like, a brand new, like, drop, like, a brand new hat, like, something that I haven't seen before. So it's like net new content to me. And they always deliver it with, like, a really beautiful, stunning image, which is not something that you're used to seeing in a text message. Right?
Max Cohen:Especially any kind of marketing text message. It's usually always like, save 50% off. It's do a Texas patch stop to not get this, and no one likes that. Right? So it's like, for those folks that really like to buy something for you, if you are gonna send a text, what are the little things you can do to make that text a little bit more interesting?
Max Cohen:Right? If it is one of those very bottom of the funnel, buy some stuff again from us text, it's all the little stuff you can do in there to make it better. But the most important thing you could do is really make sure you're isolating a segment of your audience that buying stuff from you is actually an interest they have. Right? And, you know, until you've seen someone do it multiple times, they can't say buying from you is something that they're genuinely interested in.
Max Cohen:Right?
David Gable:Yeah. I agree.
Max Cohen:Yeah. Look for that stuff.
David Gable:Yeah. I I I would say I know we're short on time, but I'd leave you with, like, three compound words, like, event based, event based, event based. Like, for if you're doing outbound and you're in sales, then you wanna be triggering these text messages to as a part of the sales process once it's already kind of been initiated or because it's been to use that word again, some major indicia that they would like to receive a text or they would be convenient way to communicate given the interest they've, you know, expressed in whatever it is that you're trying to sell to them, whether that's email opens, email replies, watching embedded videos till completion, stuff like that. We're gonna gather that visiting your website, engaging with your chatbot. You start cobbling together those with some if and statements in a HubSpot workflow, and boom, you're off to the races.
David Gable:You can do a great job at facilitating communication, not just from a primary marketing number, from an individual rep on your side. So, again, you have, like, human to human communication. The other thing I'll say, like, this is kind of a unsung hero, I think, oftentimes, support teams. I support is a is a rough business to be in, but that's a business where people want to talk to somebody. In fact, what people don't want is to deal with a lengthy IVR.
David Gable:So if you see someone trying to call into support, maybe you missed their call. Like, this could even be true for salespeople. I have this set up. You call me and I missed your call, my Kixie phone number, it auto texts you back just saying, hey. I'm stuck on another call right now or on a webinar with Hub Heroes.
David Gable:I'll get back to you as soon as I can. Here's my Calendly link to schedule a time to talk to me. Otherwise, I'm gonna I'm gonna text you right back. And I see the text message that came out from me to them on my Kixie dialer, and, like, it's great. It's great for everybody.
David Gable:I it's convenient for me because I'm stuck on doing something else, but I wanna reply. And it's great for them because they got a response from me, a human, who they want to talk to because they were calling me. Support, it's a great use case for that. Someone comes into a, you know, call queue, maybe they get stuck in an IVR situation and then they leave, they would love a text from an actual human saying, hey. This is Sarah.
David Gable:I'd love to talk to you. I noticed you dropped out of the hold. I hate being on hold too. You know what I mean? Like, that's perfect.
David Gable:Right? You saved the day. So I think knowing when to use it based off of events is key. And luckily, if you're on HubSpot, you made an amazing decision. Like, because you picked a CRM that has so many points of entry for data that you have lots of data at your disposal to look for these events to trigger
Liz Moorhead:these texts to
David Gable:trigger these calls.
Liz Moorhead:From the perspective of a consumer who has a love hate relationship with the text that I get from brands is I would encourage brands, and this I think this is true of any channel, but it's especially true of SMS. Do not treat it like every other channel. Do not make assumptions on what people want from you. Like, people will have a a much greater threshold for marketing stuff from you in your email versus your text. So everything you should be doing should be done with intention.
Liz Moorhead:You should be double, triple opting in people to make sure that that is what they really want. It is a space in which you may feel like, oh, it's the same message that we're sending out over email and we're sending out over other channels. We're just, you know, to use the word that Max didn't like from earlier, you know, blasting people into space with all of the coupons and all of the things. You're turning them off more. People are going to have a much more adverse reaction to your brand if you continue to do that.
Liz Moorhead:So just being really purposeful and intentional about, and I can't believe it's taken us this long to say it, the humans. The humans. The humans on the other end. The humans like Devin. Devin, do you have a message that you want to leave the world with as a human?
David Gable:Yeah. So As a human. As I as I
David Gable:gonna continue baiting the dead horse or, tax me. But That was beautiful.
David Gable:We were so close. I thought we hadn't convinced Max. Max, for a second, I thought we had him. I thought he was finally gonna consent. He's not.
David Gable:He's sticking by his guns. I respect
Max Cohen:Hey, man. Yeah. Hey. For sec if if it is audio. Here here's the thing.
Max Cohen:DoorDash. What can't DoorDash does it?
David Gable:The thing is is that anyone else. Yeah. Integrate SMS into your strategy. Focus on delight. Focus on, making people better off for the interaction.
David Gable:Don't think about you and what you want to get out of the interaction. Think about what the other person is going to get out of the interaction and whether or not what you are, what you're doing, how you're engaging with this person is going to is is worth the SMS. Think think of it almost as as currency. Is what you're giving them worth the intrusion? And if the answer is no, then maybe you don't need to message
Max Cohen:them. To say, is this helpful before you send it? And if you can't seriously in your heart without Yeah. Having a conversation with the person who really, really wants you to send it next to you, you can't say yes, just don't.
Liz Moorhead:Don't do it.
Max Cohen:Don't do it.
Liz Moorhead:Well, David, thank you so much for joining us this week on Hub Heroes. How can people learn more about Kixie? Yeah. Of course.
David Gable:Yeah. Dude, thank thank you so much for having me. Yeah.
Liz Moorhead:It's good.
David Gable:I mean, you can visit our website, but, hey, if you wanna be direct, we we actually have an email for anyone who's watched the podcast or met us at inbound. It's literally hubspot at kixie. We're a, diamond platinum partner. We're tiny platinum partner right now with, with HubSpot. And, anyone who emails that, like, we will roll up the red carpet for you.
David Gable:We have sales engineers specifically dedicated to HubSpot, HubSpot reps, and anyone who emails hubspot@Kixie.com, and they'll jump on calls with you. We'll give you three trials of Kixie. You can set it up, use it for a month, play around with it, see if there's features you like, features you don't like. More than that, we'll we just teach you how to use event based automations in HubSpot. Like, you email us, we'll teach you how to use them whether you use Kixie or not.
David Gable:That's just, like, a part of what we do. It's it's why we're considered a platinum partner even though we don't actually charge for for implementation services like a typical partner does, because it's part of our give back to the community kind of ethos. So email that email us there. Hubspot@Kixie.com. You heard us about us on the webinar.
David Gable:We'd love to set you up with a trial, help you out, answer any questions you have. Devon, if you could if you email us to hubspot at kixie, we will try and convince you to allow us to text you.
David Gable:We'll we'll give
David Gable:it a try.
Liz Moorhead:To do it via smoke signal at this point.
David Gable:Yes. So
Liz Moorhead:wait. I I was about to ask Devon, are you in or out on carrier pigeons? Yeah. Well, alright.
David Gable:Abstract I will dance.
David Gable:Yeah. Birds are awesome.
David Gable:What about interpret interpretive dance? Can we do that? Because there's some way we could find
Liz Moorhead:a safe space. What about a falcon? What about a falcon wearing a little cap carrying a little scroll that says the cicadas are coming?
David Gable:Oh. Well, can we just go full
Outro:Okay, Hub Heroes. We've reached the end of another episode. Will Lord Lack continue to loom over the community, or will we be able to defeat him in the next episode of the Hub Heroes podcast? Make sure you tune in and find out in the next episode. Make sure you head over to the hubheroes.com to get the latest episodes and become part of the League of Heroes.
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